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Qing cup?

by James
(California)

Hi Peter,
I am impressed by your expertise on Chinese porcelain and thank you for sharing your expertise. I got this cup recently in part because of the more unusual seal mark. Can you tell me more about this cup? It is about 3 inches tall. Is it from the Qing dynasty or a later reproduction?

Comments for Qing cup?

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Aug 31, 2011
 cup
by: peter

James, age-wise I would think it possible if it were 19th century, but as I mentioned, probably not imperial.
I have seen a number of similar marks (considered mostly fakes) on the Chinese Internet only, never in person.
Unfortunately, the use of this mark on such an item draws its authenticiy into doubt. Maybe the mark was added later? A low firing could be possible.
This imperial mark on such a teacup just seems so incongruous.
Aug 31, 2011
 follow-up (by James)
by: Anonymous

The bottom and the foot rim both appear to be glazed, but thinly and dirty, not great as you noticed. But the seal mark does seem to be underglaze. Do you think it was fired up twice?

Regarding the seal mark, is there a genuine seal of this type? Have you seen it before? If this can be a genuine seal, what Qing period would it be from?

If this is a fake, any idea when it was made? There are some old pitting marks in the center of the cup indicating some age - unless you think they faked that too?

It is interesting you mentioned that the seal would be black if written on unglazed surface, because I have a monochrome yellow plate with same seal but it is black on unglazed bottom, just like you mentioned! I will post those photos in a new thread for you to evaluate.
Aug 27, 2011
 tea cup
by: peter

Hello,
I see that you have doubts yourself... :-)
This appears to be a 'tea leaf green glaze' cup.
The mark indicates that it would have been in the department of the palace that was responsible for all matters belonging to meals, eating, etc. incl. the palace kitchen. This again means it would have been made by the imperial kiln.


Two points make me suspicious.

1. The glaze looks too rough for imperial items, including the fact that the thick glaze flowed down to the very bottom of the foot rim, in one place. I feel that an item of such quality would not have been used in the palace. Generally said, the glaze is not of the best quality as one would expect with this type of glaze, if used in the palace.

2. Is that an unglazed bottom inside the foot rim? If that is right, then the mark would have to appear almost black. Usually, underglaze blue pigment looks blue, but when fired on the unglazed clay body without glaze covering it, then the blue pigment looks black.
In this case this likely means that the mark was added later, after the kiln firing, and a pigment was used that would look blue.

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