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early republic or not

by stan day
(Milwaukie Oregon)

Hi Peter, I have seen this style on your web site before however this piece I believe is older, it has all the age signs, my question is do you think that the decal which is clearly transfer decal, was it added at a later time or is there enough evidence that it was done when it was made, I can see where the gold has been rubbed off, and could you tell me what the mark on the bottom is and the writing on the jar itself, is there a date, the porcelain is made of a high quality porcelain, you can see the light through it and it is a hand throne jar,thanks.

Comments for early republic or not

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decoration added later
by: peter

Hi Stan,
The opening up would have had only a very minor effect on the antique trade.
Before opening up, when China could not export directly, all goods went to Hong Kong, and from there they were traded/transshipped to other countries.
The real thing was that during the cultural revolution a gread destruction of China's heritage was going on. They had no mind for antiques, etc. until into the eighties.
But it is true that the decoration was probably added to make it more saleable.
Our position here is that the last modification/added decoration decides its age. As such, if it were mine I would try to scrape it off if it is not high-fired. Due to the later added decoration it cannot be considered a true antique anymore.

You see, there are lots of examples were a decoration which is added last decides item age.
For example, in export porcelain I see many fencai plates which in the west are considered to be 19th century. Those plates show foot rims that are from the "three reigns" (Kangxi, Yongzheng, Qianlong) period, however.
My conclusion usually is that such an item must be Qing dynasty Jiaqing reign, because the plate body is obviously from the previous Qianlong reign. Due to the length of the Jiaqing reign, the plates from the Qianlong era stores would likely have been used up during that reign; it would be unlikely that items with such footrims and 19th century decoration would be Daoguang, in this example.

Consider, however, if you would be able to remove the decoration. If only part goes, it makes things worse. Also check if there is some faded old onglaze decoration existing below. Scraping off the top decoration might remove that one too. Onglaze decorations are very vulnerable as they do not adhere to the glaze firmly.

added decoration
by: stan day

Hi Peter, I was talking to a friend of mine about this lidded pot, he happens to be a history buff and he was saying that China opened their doors for export to the United States in 1972 after Richard Nixon visited the Peoples Republic of China and opened export doors after more that two decades of conflict since world war 2, He thought thats when the decal was added to make it more sellable,wouldn't that make this pot more expensive in the future?. I was thinking of scraping off the decoration with a razor blade I could do it without hurting the glaze underneath or leave it and maybe some day it will be more valuable as a early piece that was exported after world ware 2, your thoughts.

writing on the bottom
by: stan day

Thanks Peter I suspected that, do you think the mark on the bottom was added as well and can you read what it says, the ones that I have seen all had writing on the side, could the writing have been there and is there a date, thanks from stan

..........................................
The marks says "Product of Hu Yuan-tai, Jiangxi" and is likely old.
P.

lidded pot
by: peter

Hi Stan,
Yes, the pot itself is old, probably late Qing to early republic, but the color decoration is about fourth quarter of 20th century at the most, I'm afraid.
This applies for the lid too.

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